So, Devahuti, she has heard from her son, Lord Kapiladeva, about the jiva, the living entity, and its relationship with the material nature. And now she wants to go one step deeper. So, she wants to understand what's the relationship with the material nature, the relationship to the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and also how the creation is coming into being, she wants to know, and also how the Lord remains transcendent to this material nature. So, she's very eager to hear from her son, understanding that He's not an ordinary being, He's the Supreme Personality of Godhead, so she is really, one can say, in ecstasy. And really wants to understand and know, first, on the deepest level. She wants to know the truth. Actually, this human form of life is meant for understanding the Absolute Truth. And that's a possibility when we have this human form of life, to understand the Absolute Truth. And when we understand the Absolute Truth, it actually can solve all problems. In this material world, so many problems, and it's a confusing place, completely confusing place. So, like Arjuna in Bhagavad-gita, he says, "Now I am confused about my duty." How is that in Sanskrit? dharma-sammūḍha-cetāḥ
Yeah. Thank you. dharma-sammūḍha-cetāḥ, "Now I'm confused about my duty. In this condition, asking You to please tell me for certain what is best for me, what is actually best for me."
So, he's admitting, "I'm confused," and that's also very important, to admit that we are confused and we are helpless, we cannot understand clearly, at least, what is right and wrong, what should be done, and what should not be done. So, we need shelter, we need direction, we need guidance from the absolute platform. So, and she says, or Arjuna says, she's saying, "Now I am surrendered, and as a soul surrendered unto You, please instruct me."
So, he's just completely surrendered. Devahuti is also completely surrendered. He's her son, but she understands clearly, He is not an ordinary son, He's the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Kunti, in her prayers, she explains very nicely about... what she says in the first sloka in her prayers:
namasye puruṣaṁ tvādyam
īśvaraṁ prakṛteḥ param
alakṣyaṁ sarva-bhūtānām
antar bahir avasthitam
That "O Krishna, I offer my most respectful obeisances unto You, because You are puruṣaṁ tvādyam..." Kunti also understands Krishna is not ordinary. He is puruṣa, He is the original personality. So, we are all persons, but Krishna is puruṣa, He is the original personality, Supreme Personality of Godhead. And she says, "You are īśvaraṁ prakṛteḥ param, You are unaffected by the qualities of this material world." Like we are always affected by the guṇas of material nature, sattva-guṇa, rajo-guṇa, tamo-guṇa, there's always, as we know from Bhagavad-gita, competition of supremacy. There is always competition of supremacy. Krishna says, sometimes the sattva-guṇa becomes prominent, defeating the mode of passion and ignorance, and sometimes the mode of passion becomes prominent, defeating goodness and ignorance, and sometimes ignorance becomes prominent, defeating goodness and passion. In this way, there is always competition for supremacy. So, it's like a war going on all the time, the modes of material nature fighting for supremacy. But Kunti says, "You are prakṛteḥ param, You are unaffected, completely unaffected by the guṇas of this material world." And from such a person, we can hear, as Supreme Personality of Godhead. And to hear from someone who is affected by the modes of material nature, it will create confusion. So, if you are, it's like if you are blind led by another blind, and if you claim that you can guide others, it's cheating. So, "You are prakṛteḥ param, You are unaffected by the qualities of this material world. alakṣyaṁ sarva-bhūtānām antar bahir avasthitam, she says. antar bahir avasthitam, You exist within and without everything." And the mystery is that alakṣyaṁ sarva-bhūtānām, yet You are invisible to all. So, greatest mystery. Krishna is within and without everything, is everywhere, yet never active. Krishna is everything actually, and still alakṣyaṁ sarva-bhūtānām, You are invisible to all. And also Kunti, she has so many realizations, practical realizations, by being put in so many difficulties together with her sons, and Draupadi. So many calamities, so many severe difficulties, but she was always successful in taking shelter of Krishna, always praying to Krishna. And in this way, her path was always, she was connected on the path of shelter, and she was successful in doing this, as well as the Pandavas and Draupadi. If you read the Mahabharata, it's like heartbreaking, what they had to go through, again and again. She says,
vipadaḥ santu tāḥ śaśvat
tatra tatra jagad-guro
bhavato darśanaṁ yat syād
apunar bhava-darśanam
So, her realization of all these difficulties is that she said, "Let all these calamities happen again and again, so that we can see You again and again, for seeing You means we will no longer see repetitive births."
So, she's just, she wants to be Krishna conscious, connected to Krishna, and she realizes these difficulties have been her greatest blessings. Actually, it's important for us to remember, because we all go through difficulties, sometimes greater difficulties and questions, and struggle, everyone, without exception. But it's the meaning behind that. And if we can understand the meaning behind those difficulties, and if we, in the difficult situation, if we can take shelter of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, like this, then we start to learn, and we make progress, we become purified, and we get so many realizations, we realize the Supreme Lord is always there, protecting me. And all these things, all these arrangements which I'm going through, it's actually perfect for me, it's perfect. Krishna is very, in a very personal way, guiding devotees, very active in devotees' lives, and the more we are seeking shelter, like the devotee or Kunti, or all the great ācāryas. So, then they can realize it becomes like an adventure. It becomes very interesting because we see that the Lord is our well-wisher, and is always there giving us guidance and support. But how is it, because it is difficult, again and again we are becoming bewildered, anyway, when we know this, still, material nature is so, very strong. But Krishna is prakṛteḥ param, He is unaffected by the qualities of the material world. And Kunti also says in the second sloka in her prayers,
māyā-javanikācchannam
ajñādhokṣajam avyayam
na lakṣyase mūḍha-dṛśā
naṭo nāṭyadharo yathā
That being beyond the range of limited sense perception, You are adhokṣaja, You are the eternally unapproachable factor, covered by the curtain of deluding energy. It's like a curtain, māyā is like a curtain of deluding energy. "You are," she says, "You are invisible to the mūḍha-dṛśā, to the foolish observer, exactly like an actor dressed as a player is not recognized."
So Krishna is invisible to the foolish observer, Krishna is taking the part of not visible to everyone. So, You are mūḍha-dṛśā, invisible to the foolish observer, exactly as an actor dressed as a player is not recognized. Like, I remember, a father was dressing up as Santa Claus, and he looked completely... I had no clue it was him. I thought this is someone else, Santa Claus. So, Kunti says like that, mūḍha-dṛśā, You are invisible to the foolish observer, exactly as an actor dressed as a player is not recognized. So, it's a great mystery, but in bhakti-yoga, everything, if we try to sincerely chant Hare Krishna, and read Prabhupada's books, life becomes so interesting. Because we start to see how Krishna is active, and Krishna is guiding us in so many ways. It's very, very merciful. In Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.3.36, it says like this, "He creates, maintains, and manifests the universes to reclaim the living beings who are within them, suffering the threefold miseries." And also the Supreme Personality of Godhead maintains everything, He is so kind, He maintains everything, and in due course of time, He also ends everything, who has help from His agents. But He is without being the least affected by such actions. That's so wonderful. So complicated, this cosmic manifestation, but Krishna is in so many things, as we know, but He is just unaffected. He is just, actually, playing. Yes, He is just having a good time, He is enjoying on the transcendental platform. So, the material nature is working under Krishna's direction. And Prabhupada is referring here in the purport to:
mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ
sūyate sa-carācaram
hetunānena kaunteya
jagad viparivartate
That is, this material nature, which is one of My energies, is working under My direction. And it's producing all moving and non-moving beings. And in this way, this cosmic manifestation is created and annihilated again and again. It's again and again taking place. So Prabhupada speaks about sat and asat. So, sat is the real reality, asat is this material world. It exists, but it's temporary, it's always changing, constantly, but in a very subtle way. Like our bodies, now when I observe you, your bodies, I don't see any changes taking place, but if we go back 5 years, 10 years, 15 years, 20 years, we saw great changes. And Prabhupada gives one example, if you go out, there are some clouds in the sky, and you say, "Okay, this is how the sky looks like." You come back half an hour later, it's another sky. The clouds are in other formations. So this is the material nature. But because we are sat, we are eternal, in illusion, we think that asat, this has substance, this will last. And that's the great illusion of this world. Because we are eternal, we want something eternal. Everyone is mad after something which has real substance, that we can trust in. Like if you have a lot of money, so much anxiety. What's going on on the market, everything is changing all the time, up and down, up and down. So many anxieties. "I want to invest in the best possible way so it will increase," but sometimes it's just opposite, and oh, so much pain and anxiety. Like this, Kruger, he crashed, Kruger crash, and Kruger was very successful businessman, but when he lost everything, he couldn't take it, and he took his life. So this is the nature of this material world. But beyond this is the spiritual sky. And when we are eternal, and the more we can connect with our true self and the relationship with the Lord, we will come to completely revolutionary insight that we can be just free from fear. Completely free from fear, because we are protected and we don't die, we are eternal. That's just wonderful. So Prabhupada is also quoting:
sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya
mūrtayaḥ sambhavanti yāḥ
tāsāṁ brahma mahad yonir
ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā
And it's verse 14.4. So, he says that, "Should be understood that all species of life are made possible by birth in this material nature, and that aham bīja-pradaḥ pitā, I am the seed-giving father." And mother nature, prakrti, is the mother, material nature with the jivas. So living entities are a combination in this way of power of the material nature and the spirit nature. So this is the situation we are in. We have to just try to understand how we should deal with this, it's a complicated situation, matter and spirit in one body like this. So there are living entities everywhere. Not only on this planet, but on all other planets. There, everywhere there are living entities. Prabhupada says even in the water there are living entities, in the fire, and also in the oceans, we have heard about the deepest, below the sea level, the deepest point in the ocean, it's located in what's called Mariana Trench. Have you heard about it? In the deepest, Mariana Trench, the deepest point in the ocean, it's in the Western Pacific Ocean. It's about 10,935 meters below sea level. So, Mount Everest is over 8,000 meters, so this is even deeper. And the amazing thing, I know the first time they were able to go down there, in 1960, and they discovered there are living entities there. There are living entities, it's completely dark. The sunlight cannot penetrate. So this distance is completely dark, but there are living entities everywhere. So this is confirmed, what Prabhupada says, everywhere there are jivas, living entities. So they have gone down there expeditions, and the pressure is, it's explained, it's 1,000 times more than on the sea level. So it has the heavy pressure. So somehow or other they have managed to go down there, and they discovered its life. Its life everywhere, or on the earth, in the earth, 2 kilometers down, there is life. So everywhere is life, and on planets, everywhere. So this is the mystery of this creation. Okay, it's five to nine, so I end here. Thank you. So, maybe we can discuss.
Q: You told that Krishna's personal guide of all of us is the most sublime, is present so we can exist. And that's led to a question that I have for a long time, something I don't understand, if I could get some sense of it, that it makes sense. But I'm wondering of the scale of this. Because we hear about Brahman as this impersonal, the oneness without any qualities, and then Bhagavan as the personal form that we can have a relationship with. So, I understand that Brahman is impersonal and Bhagavan is personal, but I'm wondering of Paramatma... where on this scale Paramatma would be? In my understanding and from your answer, did I understand also right that it is on a very personal...
A: Yes, it is most personal.
Q: Exactly, yeah. According to our...
A: And the answers you will get are personal for you, for no one else, and...
Q: I think that also His... He is personal, but when one is turned to stay in this material world and enjoy, He is very passive also, in Bhagavad-gita He is explained that He is observer, permitter, upadraṣṭā, anumantā, bhartā, bhoktā, maheśvaraḥ...
A: Yeah.
Q: He is just allowing and permitting, He is overseeing, but He is not really interfering until we... ye yathā mām prapadyante tāmṣ tathaiva bhajāmy aham, He is reciprocating as soon as we turn to Him then. And also as in the tree, He is observing us enjoying eating the fruit, that one is bitter, that one sweet, and then when we turn to Him, we're tired of just trying out the different fruits, then He becomes more personal and active in the devotee's life.
A: Hmm.
Q: But it's also interesting, isn't it, that the Paramatma is not in the spiritual world.
A: No, He is not, I read in some purport, I think.
Q: Like, what is He so...
A: He is puruṣāvatāra...
Q: Yeah.
A: for this material world, Mahavisnu, Garbhodakasayi Visnu, Ksirodakasayi Visnu. So, we have this personal form.
Q: And in the spiritual world...
A: And He is expanding as Vasudeva, Sankarshana, Pradyumna, Aniruddha...
Q: Yeah.
A: It is Visnu, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, He has that function here as Paramatma or Mahavisnu to create.
Q: Yeah.
A: So, that function is not there in the spiritual world. We have the kīrtana festival, I think you all know, and at 11:00 we will start. And, yeah, please join. And there will go on with also small talks, speeches in between, because this Friday, today is Friday, was the annual anniversary of Prabhupada's arrival in Boston, New York. So, we're celebrating that with a kīrtana festival, and we'll hear from different devotees speaking about their experience with Prabhupada, and his arrival, and how he came there and with kīrtana, started singing and conquered the world. It's from 11:00 to 5:00.
Q: Thank you. Thank you for organizing, I think it was so extremely wonderful and free, and the anniversary of last... you are always so nice and very concentrating, supporting us, so we are just being in this state, this place, and also we can just sit, sing or talk about, completely enjoying. It gets us in the best place.
A: Isvararadhana d is teaching us the art to appreciate.
Q: You are so appreciative, that's wonderful.
Q: We are also grateful for what you are doing.
A: Hare Krishna.
Q: And Prabhupada, ki...
A: Jai!